Robert A.M. Stephens
Gate's flawed links
Sat Oct 23 01:18:21 1999


are all for STS-51-L, from 13 years ago, save for only the STS-96 links.

I fail to see his point. He will no longer then be acknowledged--another transformed Ufologist idiot bordering on insecthood. Sad.

RAMS

Robert A.M. Stephens
Gates flawed STS-96 link
Sat Oct 23 01:22:00 1999


he then sends to the 'Pre-Flight' logs and no data links to the post flight mortem which is not online.

WTF is is his point?

RAMS

Gatekeeper....
Yea they are from 1988 but....
Sat Oct 23 01:20:36 1999


As a vehicle for you to pinpoint your current claim of contract work they are sufficient.

The identified parts should have been easily pointed out.

Gates of Babylon....

Robert A.M. Stephens
No Gate, you links are from the 1986 flight
Sat Oct 23 01:33:34 1999


data as a result from STS-51-L

RAMS

Gatekeeper....
The Damn date is not the question....
Sat Oct 23 01:35:28 1999


The parts you worked on are....Point them out.

Christ you are thick man!

Gates of Babylon....

Popeye (tGoSP)
Yes, but he's mostly avoiding answering.
Sat Oct 23 01:40:27 1999


Where do you think E.J. was trained?

Robert A.M. Stephens
Cliff, you have lied........
Sat Oct 23 01:29:38 1999


look at these threads. These assholes have not an interest in anything whatsoever. I have stated fact, that was covered for over a week on the national media, on all TV networks, on missions STS-96 and STS-93 post flight findings and am currently working on fixes as assigned along with a shitload of other folks and these silly cocksuckers refute it all. Yet, I am not to call them insects or be 'mean'. Fuck me. Look at the posts below this posts.

And that silly idiot Gatekeeper, who has now turned into a fuckwit, post links to 13 year old data and is some sort of fucking expert. Fuck him.

These people, I am telling you, are nuts. fucking A nuts. They are the epitome of what Ufology is about and they are stark raving loony tunes.

A total waste of time in any fashion.

I was under the impression that in seriousness these folks here were really 'into' interesting stuff.

I believe that assumption is flawed.


RAMS

MoonShadow
Haven't lied much - lately.....
Sat Oct 23 04:51:16 1999


Seems to me, Robert, your problem is simply answering a direct question....

What the hell are YOU doing to fix the shuttle? You were asked as directly as possible - you didn't provide an answer. Gatekeeper tried to help you out by providing links (doesn't matter the age - many components are still flyin' with those 13 year old - and older craft) - you didn't answer the question.

Instead, you've resorted to name-calling and character assaults again. Take that mirror of yours, and hold it in front of your face. We've seen ourselves - what do you see when you look yourself in the mirror?

How about a straight answer - or the truth for a change?

Gatekeeper....
Then go the HELL away IDIOT...your data is hearsay....
Sat Oct 23 01:34:05 1999


Your full of shit.

Of course you could choose to prove me wrong by way of some miracle but I highly doubt that.

Where can I find verifiable data that Stillwater Mills is a sub-contractor producing "Viable" parts in use on an STS.

What is you number registration or certificate for authenticity.

Gates of Babylon...

GOM
Hello again, Hazy Editor. The above post is an example
Sat Oct 23 12:44:37 1999


of another worthless use of air from a name-calling, attack oriented person.

According to my understanding of your rules, this should have been zapped about 30 seconds after being posted. It adds nothing positive.

Now here's a brilliant line "A total waste of time in any fashion." If Mr. RAMS is so disturbed about us wasting his valuable time, why doesn't he go play somewhere else where people will fall down and worship him? He appears unable to behave himself according to normal society standards, not to mention even your own board guidelines. I see much better behavior from immature high school students . . .

Respectfully,

Da Grump

:(

Popeye (tGoSP)
Impossible. B.S. falls apart at the Second Level.
Sat Oct 23 01:24:36 1999


Or the Third Level, at best.

Of course, Bob's B.S. rarely makes it the First Level.

Especially since he has apparently forgotten that we know
him and his ways and means.

Gatekeeper....
Full Of Bullshit that what you are RAMS!
Sat Oct 23 01:22:43 1999


Indeed!


Gates of Babylon....

Da Grump
RAMS = SpDrMn !!!
Sat Oct 23 03:19:39 1999


OK . . OK . . .

Just trying to get you to smile. :)

Re: RCH, yes I'm sure he's frustrated. I hear it in his voice sometimes. No, I don't think he has all the answers and I agree with you about his tactics. However, without him around, would we know more or less about the strange thinking of our "leaders". Whether they be NASA, or any of the many other rulers that we now have.

I don't know if I mentioned it to you in the past, so please forgive me if this is a dupe. The memory is the second thing to go, ya know!

Anyway, many years ago there was a cartoon called "Pogo". They printed one that really hit me: "We have met the enemy and it is us." That sadly has come true, imo.

Re: trust - for some it's easily given,
but often easily broken,
and not so easily repaired.

:(

Have a very good weekend, maybe take a few days break from the boards to clear your head. Hope to see ya back next week. I'll be in touch either way.

Gwumpy

SpDrMN
BOO!
Sat Oct 23 03:40:19 1999

GOM
Hello Hazy Editor, It appears quite obvious to me
Sat Oct 23 03:01:41 1999


that RAMS is unable to behave for even one full day. I do not approve of his foolishness. I will not tolerate any mindless attacks on another human being. I no longer care whether the alleged RAMS knows anything about anything. His childish behavior destroys any possible remaining wisp of credibility. I thought you had made it perfectly clear to him that he was to behave in a civil manner while on this board. I have already said aloha to Howl. I, like Danny has already stated, will not continue here if that kind of atmosphere is going to be tolerated.

For the good of the board, I respectfully request that you give the keys back to Gates. ASAP.

Very seriously this time,

Da Grump

:( :(

E.J.
"Warning" cryptic message
Sat Oct 23 03:59:26 1999


UFO

Gatekeeper....
That's quite alright....
Sat Oct 23 03:05:11 1999


I have just been given a BBS with passcode protection where you can't even read what is being discussed unlesss you go through the passcode phase.

People who want to contribute can get in touch and then we will begin again.....Minus the distractions.

Considerate people need only apply....

Gates of Babylon....

Hazy Editor
GOM, thanks for expressing your concerns.
Sat Oct 23 04:28:27 1999


We are adequately staffed now by individuals with admin privileges to this board. Unfortunately, all of us can't be here to administer the board 24 hours a day. Because this is an open forum which encourages and invites discussion on a variety of topics, sometimes we have to tolerate a little bad with the good. You put any number of people together to discuss any topic, I guarantee there will always be the disgruntled and the dissenting. You see, we can't please all the people all the time, so we're just better off not trying.

Regarding your feelings about Robert A.M. Stephens, you're not the only one who has expressed dissatisfaction with the content of his posts. I've stated before, and will do so again now, Stephens is welcome to post here any time he feels like - so long as he doesn't get too vulgar, or engage in character assaults. Same goes for most anybody else who wanders in the door. If we start excluding people just because we don't like them - we will find ourselves less than the sum of all that we can become.

Posts that fall outside of acceptable parameters (i.e. TOS, vulgar, character assaults, etc.) have been deleted recently. GOM, take a close look, Stephens was not the only one engaged in character assaults and name-calling during the past couple of days.

Gatekeeper stated in his previous post, "I have just been given a BBS with passcode protection where you can't even read what is being discussed unlesss you go through the passcode phase." That might be a good place to have a focused discussion on particular projects, but it falls way outside the scope of what this discussion board is. You don't have to be invited to come here. You don't have to have passwords to read the messages. You don't have to have another special code to post.... and Accountability will keep us all in line.

GOM
Thx for clarifying your position. I doubt that . . .
Sat Oct 23 12:06:18 1999


Accountability can keep RAMS in line, unless he also has delete capability.

And btw, the board did not degenerate into a howling mess until the alleged Mr. RAMS showed his wonderful, all-knowing self here. He does get under some people's skin, which can cause a reaction. But that's just his game. I laugh at him, but I really shouldn't. It's really rather pathetic.

We live in a society that is deteriorating into an attack mentality and considers that to be humor/entertainment. I deplore that type of activity anywhere. I thought here that you kind of were emphasizing quality over quantity. Did I misjudge the situation?

If Mr. RAMS can show himself capable of carrying on a civil conversation for one full week, I would be very, no make that extremely, surprised.

Thx for listening . . .

Da Grump

:(

Wun
GOM..Hazy Editor..
Sat Oct 23 05:56:53 1999


is leaving the banner up beause most of the RAMS groupies will click on it and go on..to a place where they are comfortable..the primordial ooze of Behold V..and stop messing up this place..no?

As far as RAMS is concerned..if ..his..attitude is consonant with the his employers in NASA..then why do we all keep voting them tax money to sneer at the very people they are..supposedly.working for..the taxpayer..!!

We would not take that attitude from a CEO of a private company..would we??..well I would definitely NOT..so..

Throw them out.. and put in people who actually think that the average American is more than slime.. and might have a braincell or two..

I know he says he is a private contractor..makes no difference..the attitude probably is pervasive..

IMO.

GOM
Morning Wun, Personally I must admit . . .
Sat Oct 23 11:55:28 1999


that I have severe doubts about the alleged RAMS' alleged connection to NASA. Probably just a figment of his own imagination. I have no problem with the BeholdV banner as long as Bobby stays in his playpen. When he comes out and attacks Gates, or anyone else for that matter, I say throw the clown out and keep him out. He's too old for corrective action and does not appear to listen to reason, even from Jason who is remarkably willing to tolerate behavior that I do not. I do not have an Internet background, so maybe that is the difference in our perspective . . .

And btw, if Danny is gone, that is not good. Danny is a true searcher, not a foul mouthed windbag like the alleged RAMS. I'll take one Danny over an army of RAMSes.

Anyway, thanks.

Da Grump

:(

Debaser
Oh hell, just for the record
Sat Oct 23 16:37:17 1999


Since we're on the subject, I'll say my piece.

I think RAMS has some decent concepts and thoughts regarding the problems with UFOlogy. However, when he starts frothing he makes it easier for people to miss the point. The issue becomes his behavior instead of his ideas. He came back this time and started attacking people (even if he was joking, it was seen as an attack); he obviously doesn't realize the gap in time is a new start, but he continues his actions as though he was freshly insulted. Some who are here were not when the previous situation was occurring. By not putting it to rest, he accepts and propagates the cycle. "But what am I supposed to do when someone starts calling me names first??" Who freakin' cares? My God, if we were to all lose it when someone without half a clue goes off, we'd be in even *better* shape than we are now as a society (sarcasm). And then to come back and start spouting, putting down people's ideas and work (that he indirectly advocated, btw) and then leaving with a blanket statement of how everyone is a [insert obscene name here] is no better than the same people he admonishes in his rants. Its disappointing.

I understand where he gets upset when people ask for proof in an accusatorial manner. I'm not saying anyone did or did not do this this time around. But sooner or later, he's got to put it up. There's a way to do this without giving in to the "you're not part of NASA, prove it!" and then explain why he wouldn't answer the questions. I would imagine his stance would be that he shouldn't have to, and will not, do this. That's fine but the mirror then becomes meaningless and the tactics become hypocritical rather than a lesson. Just buying into the cycle of idiocy does no one any good.

The statement by GOM that made me decide to post this was that I spoke rationally to him. If I were to not speak rationally to him, I'd have no leg to stand on in my criticism. I've tried the other way. I've tried this way now. There's a point where one says they've tried and has to put it behind them, especially when they're mindlessly grouped in with everyone else he is pissed with. That's the path I'm at now...not to say it'll stay that way, but I see no rational reason why it shouldn't.

Jason

GOM
Well Jason, I see that burning logic as always . . .
Sat Oct 23 17:16:32 1999


I treat people how they treat me. If RAMS wants to start any fights, I will not approve. If he wants to lump me, or you, in with the lunatic ufologists then he is sadly wrong.

I will state this to RAMS: I am a very blunt person. When I step on toes, I apologize. You want to talk civil. I will talk. I do not intimidate. I am not easily impressed.

I am impressed that Jason can tolerate as much garbage out of you as he does. I will not. Act like a responsible, decent human being and we can communicate. I doubt we will agree on everything. I question everything and everybody. I drive people crazy around here with questions. But I attempt to do it in a positive manner.

RAMS, I do agree with you that there are problems with the UFO community. Btw, I am neither part of ufology, nor am I part of NASA. There are problems on both sides. If your job is to defend NASA, you have done the worst possible job that I can imagine. I take great exception to the trail of carnage that you have wreaked upon innocent human beings. I have never heard you apologize for the damage you have caused. I will tell you to your face that I am highly suspicious of your claims, your alleged contacts and almost everything about you. You do not answer direct questions very often, which leads me to conclude that you do not have the answers. I am willing to be proven wrong. As I posted several days ago to RAMS/e.j. - put up or shut up. I don't play games with people and, in respect to Jason, I will try to understand and communicate with you one more time. But it will not degenerate into name calling and garbage. I have no time for foolishness. I have already apologized for laughing at you. I thought you might have been just a bunch of college kids spoofing us.

I will be back Monday night. I will look for your response.

Da Grump

:( :(

Hazy Editor
Accountable, to ourselves first - can be
Sat Oct 23 15:06:48 1999


a hard act to follow - and is always the wisest choice to make, the best path to follow.

Let me again emphasize - as we move forward and on - that we were tested these past few days and some of us didn't do very well. If the topics we discuss are so important (and I believe they are), then we shouldn't allow ourselves to become consumed by bickering. We should focus on the goals we wish to achieve, and not the distractions which misdirect our attention.

Any group of people will have obstacles to overcome to achieve their objectives. The obstacles might include many different things (money, resources, information, etc.), but the biggest obstacle we have to overcome many more times is being able to get along with people we despise for one reason or another. Stephens instantly pushes buttons in some of us to push us to outrage and beyond. How will we treat the politician who wields a lot of power and with whom we disagree? How will we treat the scientist or researcher whose ideas are beyond the fringe of our current understanding and acceptance? If we can't treat them on a higher level than some of what we've seen the past few days - then the "exceptional" or "great" ones might not feel comfortable coming into our forum.

Something to ponder while you are hopefully enjoying a wonderful weekend.

GOM
Thanks H. E. - I am pondering . . .
Sat Oct 23 15:35:37 1999


and enjoying the 85 degree sunny CA weather. Thanks!

However, if you think that there is even one pol, scientist, researcher, or even just Joe Average out on the street (kind of like me) that behaves like the alleged Mr. RAMS and gets away with it . . . Well, not in my neighborhood.

I would be more than happy to engage in an intelligent, civil conversation with anyone on this board, including RAMS if he is capable. He does not impress me. He does not intimidate me like he apparently intimidates others. He makes me laugh sometimes, but that's sad because it's not good to laugh at people that apparently can't help their lack of social skills. He brushes off his attack mentality with some lame excuses about being Mr. Mirror. No excuse for bringing so much hurt to the world. I think he is the one that is at least partially responsible for destroying David Oates. That was not necessary, it was not funny, it was not cute, it was not "protecting NASA" (now there's a laugh and a half). It was just flat wrong. It's wrong morally. It is wrong to destroy a human being and laugh while you do it, or attempt to do it. I am against fighting and RAMS appears to be 99% for fighting. I am not part of ufology. I am not part of NASA. I am a truth seeker. NASA does some good stuff. Some ufologists do good stuff. It's obvious that something is going on and secrets are being kept. I doubt that anybody has given RAMS any secrets on the space program or any black projects. Even if he had any secret knowledge, I would not believe him from observing his recent behavior. I will give him another chance. We shall see where that leads . . .

Sorry to be so long-winded. I appreciate your words. It's just that, well I just went back and read your post again. The "distractions" you speak of started up when Mr. RAMS reappeared. To me, it looks like he enjoys playing hit and run, aggravate and hide, stir up trouble, name call and other nonsense. It's impossible to deal rationally with an irrational person. I would much rather that you institute the automatic delete button for RAMS until he can prove that he can behave. Why is it logical to let him continue to provide the "distraction" that you seem to also deplore?

Respectfully,

Da Grump

:(

Robert A.M. Stephens
what wall did you hit, Gate?
Sun Oct 24 05:10:50 1999


You state you "hit your wall, as you all know" in a post below. Explain this?

RAMS

Gatekeeper....
Re: what wall did you hit, Gate?
Sun Oct 24 13:17:21 1999


What I mean is that I surpassed my limits on anger management and you just happen to have caused my outburst of anger. You have been away a good amount of time. You return and with not so much as a week you had everyone labeled in derogatory terms. You didn't give us any chance to outline what we had been up to though I believe you had been watching without comment for a period of time.

I guess I didn't and still don't understand why you would throw that radical of a curve seeing that you could have just cut into the conversation on MoonCam with reverence that is was really a concept based on "Everyman" getting involved in a small way that isn't just stupid speculation.

A lot of reading and research as well as good inquiry has taken place, we have a long road to go for sure and you can really be an asset and you know it. I would assume that you would find great satisfaction in the returns on your investment of patience to explain a direction of study within the current goal like the MoonCam....People like Me or Tilos or Jason or whoever when they comeback with nicely worded questions that you would have to know would be based on a genuine result of acknowledged study into the subject.

You do remember Femto-Photonics and you having introduced that to the boards? I worked hard on that and found a good supply of data....It needed direction as you well know....And I did that when it was smack in the middle of the real shitstorm remember? It was because I and others are serious about this "Will to Learn" but JeeeZZZ we do have our limits man!

We are adults aren't we? We invest our own time to do this cause we care....and share the fascination...you more than anyone should appreciate that aspect alone....I have never witnessed a Launch in person....I envy you that!

Take it or leave it....I will not last long when broad stroke bullshit accusations fly that are aimed at disruption and chaos....I'll hold my tongue for a certain amount of time and even joke around and you can see that below from the other day...

Anyway I hope that helps.

Gates of Babylon....

Robert A.M. Stephens
RE: Gates: Wall
Mon Oct 25 06:35:35 1999


Good post above.

Clears up the rail

My one year odyessy within 'Strange' (no, I am not Hitler-jeezzzz) is still as episode 24 of ST: TNG. ala, we are love, you are insects. You have to just smile slightly.

Moon Cam I did not what it was--did not attack it I don't think, other than giving poor innocent Jason some RAMS type insect data along with , "who gives a shit," stuff. Harmless.

Why is Rocky Jones a molestor.........just wondering..........

Thanks for the data

RAMS

Debaser
poor innocent me *smirk* :) n/m
Mon Oct 25 12:22:31 1999

Robert A.M. Stephens
At JPL, you may want to reach out
Sun Oct 24 05:12:40 1999


to the fact some there are attempting to arrange for the construction of a UFO detector out at the 1.1c.ly distance from sol, if you are interested.

RAMS

Debaser
Thinking about this...
Mon Oct 25 02:32:33 1999


I'm puzzled as to the practicality of such a detector. Would they be putting the physical machinery at 1+ l.y. away? That's a lot of travel time to get it there and then waiting on the communications to and from...just doesn't seem possible with what I know of our current technology. Even a near-earth based satellite would seemingly encounter a ton of interference trying to look that far off, given the bodies of the solar system as well as the Oort cloud. There seems to be a gap that I'm not picking up on that would make this highly impractical if not implausible.

Jason

Grendel
Re: The Kinder, Gentler RAMS
Sun Oct 24 16:50:48 1999


Well, if it's true, I welcome it but pardon me if I allow a little time for my natural scepticism to subside. As it happens, I was reviewing Mein Kampf recently. Some of the parallels are interesting.

Hitler clearly outlined his plans for gaining power. Among them:

(1) Identify a group -Jews- on which everything can be blamed.

(2) Attack critics by identifying them with that group or as sympathetic to it.

(3) Respond to challenging questions with violence, abuse and inflammatory rhetoric, to divert the public's mind from noticing that you fail to answer.

(4) Build a loyal following by hinting at great things to come. Once you are in power, you won't have to make good. The end justifies the means.

(5) When opposed by a superior force, pretend to side with them until the opportunity arises to attack them successfully. (The pact with Stalin)

Now substitute 'Strange' for Jews. See any similarities?

Hey - RAMS is no Hitler, not even close, but I have to wonder if we're at point (5) at the moment.

I sincerely hope not, and maybe this post will be seen as counter-productive but - to carry on the analogy a bit further... there is the famous sequence that starts: "When they came for the Jews, I said nothing, because I wasn't a Jew..." etc.

So I'm saying something...posting a caveat: only time will tell. And hoping for the best. I really do feel he could make a valuable contribution here. He has before. I was a RAMS supporter at the outset, until all the nonsense started. I would like to be again.

So if the leopard really has changed his spots I apologize in advance. :)

Upgrade
Want to know the Truth
Sun Oct 24 21:38:34 1999


RAMS stands for

Remote
Agent
Master
Server

The link to "test" subjects that have AI implants.

BTW DELILIA is ??????

A joke of course ....:|

As it would be playing with fire if true... you know

GOM
Here's the only two reasons that I hate Grendel . . .
Sun Oct 24 21:37:39 1999


Warning: SSS in progress. (Severe Sarcasm Syndrome)

#1. He's way too quiet.

#2. When he finally gets around to posting something, he makes way too much sense.

Well, actually there is a third pretty good reason to hate Grendel . . . He's retired!!! Are we going to tolerate that on Hazy? It sets a very bad precedent, imo.

And now I just thought of #4 reason to hate Grendel - his posts are better than mine . . . What's up with that? I'm getting really steamed here!!!

I hope that clarifies my position and if I think of any more these excellent reasons to hate Grendel, you'll be the first to suffer.

Da Grump
Senior Vice President
of the 3G Foundation
(Get Grendel Going)

:)